What it takes to succeed in the podcast industry with Arielle Nissenblatt

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Arielle is a podcast marketing expert who helps creators with podcast growth through her extensive experience and love for audio. She is the founder of EarBuds Podcast Collective, a weekly podcast newsletter and podcast and is passionate about helping people find their next favourite podcast.

In this episode of Creators on Air, we talk all about what it takes to create a great podcast, the meaning behind setting your goals and how to build a community with your audience.

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Episode Transcript

Akta: There are over 2 million podcasts worldwide, and that number seems to be growing. Even creators who started on other platforms like YouTube and Twitter have started their own podcast. You have to start a podcast to why you should start a podcast, why you should create a podcast today, but is creating a successful podcast really as easy as it seems. 

Arielle: I think it's easy to create a bad podcast.

It's really easy to create a shitty podcast. It's hard to make a podcast that is actually gonna get listened to beyond your small group of friends and family or your company. 

Akta: Ariellele Nissenblatt loves podcasts. As she says, she loves listening to them. She loves making them, and she loves marketing them. She's been working in the podcast space since early 2017 and she has a lot to say on podcasts.

Arielle: I was a listener first. I started listening in 2014 to podcasts and was immediately entertained and hooked, and I had never been a huge reader. Listening to podcasts really scratch the itch of wanting to learn about the world or wanting to pop into this conversation going on. Um, you know about this topic that I wasn't getting because I didn't like to sit down with a newspaper or sit down with a website or sit down with a book because I'm somebody who needs to be moving.

Podcasts allow me to go on a walk and also consume all this information. So, Started listening, loving it. And then for a while, I, I was saying I would never have a podcast of my own. I, I was like, there are too many podcasts, even in 2017 when there were just hundreds of thousands as opposed to millions. I don't need to contribute my voice to this.

And then I was like, you know what? I should probably walk the walk too. I, I advised people on how to make podcasts. I should probably try it for myself and, you know, have the experience of setting up an RSS feed and scheduling interviews and editing tape, and even hiring. Uh, people to edit the tape for me.

So eventually I became a creator myself. But I think ultimately I just. Want more people to be able to experience the same thing I did, which was, wow, look at this whole world that can be opened up for you if you just put headphones in or go on a walk or just be quiet for a minute and listen. Mm-hmm. 

Akta: And I do feel like more people are definitely entering that world, either as definitely creators, but also as a creator, like I've noticed.

Yeah. I've noticed so many creators who maybe started on YouTube and they've started a podcast, or they're on Instagram and they've started a podcast. Do you think podcasts are quite easy to get into? Do you think it's like. Easy to create a good podcast? 

Arielle: I think it's easy to create a bad podcast. It's really easy to create a shitty podcast.

Um, it's hard to make a podcast that is actually gonna get listened to beyond your small group of friends and family or your, your company. Um, I was just talking about this with a friend who's been in the podcast business forever. He was in the radio business for, for years and years. Not enough people when they set out to make a podcast, take stock of the community or the audience, or the demographics that they intend to be serving.

What do they need? Who should be the host? How long should the show be? Why should this show be made and what are the ultimate goals for it? So this is all to say anybody can start a podcast, right? You don't even need a mic to make a shitty podcast. You can open up a laptop, you can open up squads. You can open up Riverside.

You can open up Zoom, you can hit record. And if you want it to be a solo podcast, you open up a free service like Audacity. You can record, have that show up on the airwaves by that afternoon, that does not mean it's actually gonna get listened to. And even if it does get listened to, it doesn't necessarily mean it's serving your ultimate goals.

And so I, I always advise people, you know, think about what your goals are. You don't need to reach 10 tens of thousands of downloads per episode, or tens of thousands of people per month. You don't need that. But you need to figure out what is going to be as sustainable for you, what's gonna make you want to continue doing.

Akta: Hmm. I think that's a really good point, and I think that's applicable to, mm-hmm. All types of content as well. Like who's your audience? What value do you want to provide? What about the more, so that's like a strategic part of it. What about the more technical aspects? So like for, for YouTube for example, you know that you can kind of help your videos perform?

Well, if you have good editing or if your thumbnails are good, is that we don't as relevant 

Arielle: podcasts that you should. Sorry that I'm just so excited. Sorry to cut you off. 

Akta: No, it's fine. I love 

Arielle: that. I love the energy and we don't know yet as much about what makes a podcast successful. Because there's just been mm-hmm.

Less time. Um, although, you know, podcasts have been around since 2004. Um, YouTube has been around, around the same time, but the, the mass creation of podcasts didn't really take off until after that. So we don't have as much experimentation. We don't have as much, um, As many examples to pull data from. So what I will say is cover art is super important.

Your podcast cover art needs to be beautiful. It needs to be, and, and you know, more important than, than it being beautiful, it needs to actually reflect what's in the show. And it also needs to ref reflect the quality of the show. So if you have a great podcast and your cover art is ugly, or it's not, it doesn't hit the tone of what's in the show, people are gonna be turned off.

You need at every. To be keeping up the expectations of what your, um, potential listeners might be interested in. So if your podcast is about creators, what visual cues are you giving that this show is about creators? What visual cues are you giving that this show is an interview show that this show is going to ultimately be helpful.

Then once people click on your show, the first 30 seconds or the trailer, um, are. Accurately reflecting what is going to be beyond the first 30 seconds or beyond the trailer. And then in every single episode, are you delivering, uh, on that promise? Are you making sure that your listeners are taking the time and then being given what they have?

You know, obviously they're not paying anything, right? In some situations they're paying, but mm-hmm. If they are not paying, they are paying with their time. So are they actually getting out of this what you promised them by way of the cover, up by way of the first 30 seconds by way of your episode descriptions by way of the social media that points them there.

Akta: Yeah, but how do you measure that? Because I mean, when I look at the stats, all I'm really looking at is podcast downloads because there's not much else there to look at. Like whereas YouTube, I've got, yeah. You know, my clickthrough rate and things like that. So how do you know if you are being successful with having good cover art and having a good episode where first 30 seconds are 

Arielle: bringing people in?

Some hosting sites will give you data such as, listen. And that can be a really, really helpful barometer to figure out if people are actually listening. You know, beyond, you can figure out are they skipping through certain sections of the show? Um, are they making it to the end? There are things like that, but you're right in that there are not as many data points for podcast listening as there are for other forms of media on the internet.

And that is something that people are constantly working. And there are some solutions out there that you can sort of hack it. The best solution though is to ask your listeners, and there was an article that came out this past week from Sounds Profitable, which is a really great newsletter that folks should be subscribed to, and.

It's um, Tom Webster, who's one of the partners that sounds profitable, outlined five questions that you should ask your audience about what they like about your show. Because he says that if you go up to somebody who is a podcast listener and they listen to your show, lucky if you find somebody who listens to your exact show or maybe you ask them on social media, Hey, can we have five minutes to chat?

And you just say to them, what do you like about my show? They might. Yeah, I like you. I like your vibe, I like the company, whatever, but that's not really gonna give you much information. So there are these five specific questions that you should ask them, and one of them is, Where did you find my podcast?

And when did you find my podcast? Right? So what was the situation? What made you actually wanna hit play on this podcast? And I'm not gonna remember all five of them off the top of my head, so I encourage folks to go and check this out. But, um, a, a really big part of this is really just asking your audience and then I'll even push back on my own.

Um, advice here, which is like sometimes you don't have enough, a big enough audience to get a nice sample size, and that can be tough. So it's sort of about you wanna serve the audience that exists. So asking your listeners what they think of your show, how they found your show, what other podcast they listen to.

The other questions that Tom Webster outlines, definitely ask them those questions. And while you only have maybe a hundred downloads and only five people are gonna get back to you about potentially giving you some feedback on it, I think you need to take those five people at their word. Extrapolate that data and say, okay, you know, until I know more, I'm gonna go off of this.

So while the, the data points are not there, like they are for YouTube, we need to be asking, we need to be asking these questions. Yeah. I 

Akta: think those are great questions. Especially how did you find me? Because that's the one question I won answered more than anything, and I've never actually thought to just go out and ask it.

What have you found to. The most effective ways to get 

Arielle: people to find your podcasts. Um, so the advice that I give when I am advising people on podcast growth strategies is, you know, there's short-term spikes that you could go after, and then there's long-term spikes that will actually stick around. So the short-term spikes are getting featured in podcast listening apps, getting written up in the New York Times or smaller publications.

Other sorts of like mentions and press, uh, maybe you pay for an influencer ad or something like that. The longer term, the, the things that will help you get a spike and then that spike will sustain are things like collaborations with other shows, consistent collaborations with other shows that are similar to you, that have similar vibes to you.

So for example, You know, setting up cross promotions with other shows about creators. For example, setting up you regularly appearing as a guest on another creator focused podcast, setting up an opportunity for sort of crossover episode between your show and another creator focused episode that you then drop in both of your feeds if another audience can get to know you and.

Your audience can get to know another creator. Your shows become best friends and the the people who listen are gonna ultimately be interested in both of your shows. And a lot of people, I'll push back on myself. A lot of people will say, why would I wanna, you know, send people to another show when I want them to listen to my show?

And my answer to that is, if you're afraid that they're going to leave you for another podcaster, then your podcast probably isn't good. Right. 

Akta: So true. But can I ask, how does that work for Interview Style Podcast? So, for example, like this podcast now, if I was to have like a guest on. Would they be my guest or would they be helping me interview another guest?

Like how 

Arielle: does that, I guess it depends. You know, there's no set, there's nothing set in stone, so I'll give a few examples. Right now, I am in the second month of my podcast about podcast trailers, so if you follow me on social media, you'll see that I did a whole huge rollout about this show every single time that this podcast was mentioned.

In a newsletter, on another podcast. In a podcast listening. I shouted it from the rooftops. I did a lot of, um, like just buzz building that was like a really big part of it. And another thing I did was I pitched myself as a guest on other shows to talk about the art of the podcast trailer. So that was now my new thing.

So because the show is about podcast trailers, I said, you know, have me on your show to talk about podcast trailers and why podcast creators need a trailer. And of course because of my newfound quote unquote expertise on making trailers, um, I'm gonna talk about that. But then I'm also going to say, and by the way, the reason I know about all this is because I started a podcast about podcast trailers and that is ultimately going to push people to listen to the show.

And so, When I was pitching myself to be a guest on this sh these shows, I wasn't necessarily saying, let's do a one-to-one swap. I'll be on your show. You'll be on my show. But I might say, here's what I can offer in return. But they might just be willing to have me as a guest because it's good content.

You know what I mean? Like why are you having me on your show right now? I pitched myself as a guest on this show. And you're doing it because ultimately this might be helpful for your listeners and in exchange, I am going to go on social media and I'm gonna say, check this out. I think you should be subscribed to this podcast because it's a great resource for creators.

So it's like there's handshake agreements happening all the time. You know, you're not signing anything that says, because I am ha having you on my show, you are going to do X, Y, and Z. And if you don't, then I'm not gonna air your episode. You're not doing that. Hopefully, yeah. 

Akta: Yeah, definitely. It's a lot more authentic, which I like.

And it, it's, it works in favor for both parties. Um, you mentioned posting on social media. Are there any best practices to promote your own episodes on social media? Like the best way to do that? Yeah. 

Arielle: Episode. Yeah. I think the first thing to think about is, or the first thing to keep in mind, and I'm sure this is.

And across the board, truth for all social is that it doesn't convert. You know, people don't generally leave the social media platform that they're on in order to go check out something else. And the reason for that is partly because the social platforms don't want you to do that. The social platforms are incentivized to keep you on that social platform.

They want you to keep scrolling, keep scrolling, keep scrolling, and if a link takes you off, they're gonna bury that link And they're. That post is not necessarily going to, um, you know, go viral in as much likelihood as a, a post that is like designed specifically for that platform. Yeah. However, every social post that you create surrounding, uh, an episode launch or a new podcast launch or whatever, contributes to people understanding who you are and what your goals are.

So I do recommend. Having social handles for your podcast, and sometimes you don't need to create individual social handles, handles for your podcast, depending on how similar what you podcast about is to your overall creator persona. So, okay. For me, for example, I did not make a specific Twitter handle for the Trailer Park podcast, but I did make an Instagram handle because I knew that I wanted to show off the cover art of the other podcasts that are being featured.

Twitter doesn't necessarily love images in the way that Instagram does, so I was like, all right, Instagram is our thing here. I'm not necessarily gonna do it for Twitter, but on Twitter I am posting about this because it aligns closely enough with my personal brand to talk about podcasts so that I can post about the episodes when they, when they launch, and I can do whatever, and people will ultimately see that as, um, feeding back to me and feeding back to the podcast.

Best practices for posting on social are, you know, a lot of people make the mistake of. Every time they drop an episode just going on social and being like, new episode out now here's a link to it. Go check it out. Who gives a shit that's so boring? Yeah, you have to give people a reason. You have to give, you have to, you have to write well, you have to make people want to stick around and be interested in your, in your, in your tweets and your Instagram posts and your blog content, whatever.

Um, I think a good rule of thumb, If somebody were to discover your Twitter, if somebody were to discover your TikTok, your Instagram, your LinkedIn, They need to see the content that you post as natively written for that platform. Mm-hmm. And maybe it ultimately funnels into your podcast or to your YouTube channel, or to whatever your ultimate end of funnel path is.

But ultimately, if people see what you're putting out on social and they think, oh, she's just constantly trying to get me to go somewhere else, that just doesn't come off as authentic. So I think a good rule of thumb is, um, make sure. If somebody were to discover you it on whichever platform. Can be the end path for them.

And if they wanna discover more, you have a link in your bio to explain where more is. Mm-hmm. 

Akta: Okay. And what about YouTube, do you feel, cause I mean, I feel like video podcasting has become so, so popular now. I mean, are your, are your podcasts on YouTube? Is that something you think is a opportunity people should, should not miss out 

Arielle: on?

When you, when you say video podcasts are so popular now, what do. 

Akta: I feel like most people are so like I am like recording an or a video version of that same podcast. I'm posting it directly to YouTube just because YouTube has that discoverability feature, 

Arielle: I guess. Yeah, so I'll say this right now as we record this in early March of 2023, there's no such thing as a quote unquote YouTube podcast.

There is a YouTube video that is being, And it is maybe your podcast in video form, but it's not contributing to your r s s feed. You are not currently gaining downloads. However, last week at Hotpod Summit in Brooklyn, it was announced that YouTube will soon be ingesting. RSS feeds and you will soon on YouTube music be able to lock your phone and listen to a podcast.

That is huge news, but it is not currently a thing. It, it will be a thing in a few weeks, probably by the time this episode is out there will be some changes. And what's the, however significance 

Akta: of that? 

Arielle: Sorry, what's the significance of that? Oh, it's huge. It means that like, yeah, you can take advantage of all these YouTube algorithms that you might have mastered, um, and potentially find new listeners.

A lot of people use YouTube to look for content to consume, and they don't care if that podcast, if that, if what they're consuming is a podcast or it's a YouTube video. And if you're a podcaster and you are putting your interviews just like we're having right now on YouTube, and in the past it was just people watching your YouTube video.

Great. It's still, I, I think overall contributes to people understanding who you are. Maybe funneling back to your website, maybe funneling back to your podcast eventually. That's great. Um, but up until now it wasn't contributing to your podcast. Right. And now it, it. Not, not now. Soon. It can. Yeah. So as long as you set that up, as long as you set up the r s s integration, it's coming.

And I don't have the full details and I don't know exactly how it's gonna work. Um, I will know more soon. I'm meeting with somebody at Google at podcast movement next week about how they're gonna roll this out. But, um, yeah, I mean, when people say, Quote unquote YouTube podcasts or video podcasts. Really, they are just talking about taking the video that we're recording right now and putting it up on TikTok, putting it up on YouTube, putting it up on Instagram reels.

It's not, it's not really a podcast. It's just a video that you're putting in there. Microphones in the image, right? Yeah. We're having a conversation True. So soon. That will be a thing soon. Video podcast will be a thing. Me personally, I don't believe. That if you like to make audio for the sake of making audio, you need to make video.

I think that if you love audio and if your listeners love strictly listening to you with audio, I think it is okay more than okay. I think it is. Beautiful and fine to just create audio. I love audio for the sake of audio. I personally don't consume podcasts by way of video. I am out in the park. I'm going for a walk.

I'm, I'm doing the dishes. I don't have my eyes available when I, I'm listening in the shower. I don't have my eyes available. I'm not, I'm not watching. It's expensive too. If you don't have the budget, if you don't have the time, if you don't have the resources to make high quality video content with hopefully multiple camera angles, cuz, or else it's boring if you don't have the budget for.

It might not be worth your time. However, you could take this recording right now, split it up into clips, and those clips could be enticing for people. You could put those on YouTube, you could put those on Instagram, you could put those on TikTok. You can do all that and ultimately get people excited about the content that we're discussing right now.

And then maybe that they'll say, oh, you know what? I want more where that came from. I'm gonna go check out the show. So I love video. I love video content as a way of funneling into the longer form audio. I don't necessarily think that you must be creating full video episodes. Yeah, 

Akta: no, that's really true and I agree with you and that's exactly what we are doing with this podcast.

But the only thing that I do like about having it on YouTube, I dunno if this is just me getting validated, is I get comments on those videos so I like actually get to directly hear from my audience, which is really nice. That's huge. Um, but then I know that like Apple has Apple ratings and things like that.

Is it important, do you think, to get reviews? Ratings on your podcast, and if so, what's the best way to encourage it? I 

Arielle: guess it is important to get ratings and reviews for the same reason that we talked about earlier, which is, it's great to hear from your listeners. Mm-hmm. What do they like about the show?

What don't they like about the show? What could they do without, what can't they live without? It is not important for the algorithm. You will hear people on podcasts all the time say, leave us a rating interview. Help us ride the algorithm waves, and it doesn't mean anything. There have been articles put out by Apple for years now saying that that's a, a thing that happened years ago.

It is not a thing anymore, so get it out of your vocabulary listeners. That when you're creating a podcast, you don't need to say that You can ask for ratings and reviews because it looks good. Because it feels good to receive them. And also because social proof is important. You know, if somebody, um, goes to your podcast on Apple Podcasts and they see no ratings and reviews, they might be like, oh, does anybody.

Even listen to this show. So it is good for that reason, but it is not doing anything. It's not helping, uh, sorry, not anything. It's not doing anything to help your show ride the algorithm waves or ride the charts or anything like that. It is good because of social proof. It's gonna, you know, it's gonna mean, oh, somebody was here before me.

So I encourage them. I encourage you to ask for ratings and reviews, but I also encourage you to ask for ratings and reviews in a way that. Um, different, you know, you're gonna hear every single podcast you listen to is gonna say, leave us a rating and review wherever you get your podcast. It almost becomes nothing.

It, it, it, it's almost like saying, hi, how are you? You, you know that nobody actually cares how you are. Yeah. So it's kinda like, let's, you know, give people a reason to give a rating and review. If you want them to say something, tell them what to say. Maybe you, maybe if your podcast is about coffee, you can say, tell me about your favorite, um, coffee buying region, or what's your favorite roast?

You know, let us know in the, in the reviews, like, we love getting ratings and reviews. We love hearing from you. Um, if you don't know what to say, tell us about your favorite coffee roast. You know, for you, you could say, if you, um, really like this interview, uh, with Arielle let us know. You know, what's your favorite podcast?

Tell us in the ratings and tell us in the reviews. We'd love to know. Mm-hmm. Um, you know, I think people want to help. People wanna help, but they don't necessarily know what to say and they're not just gonna be like a great show. Love the show. Um, yeah, cuz that's just, it's not enough. And then also change up your call to action every single episode.

So it takes time. And like, sometimes you're gonna wanna tack on, uh, an outro that has the same, leave us a rating and review wherever you get your podcast. But it's, but it, it, it will be more effective for you if you say something. Hey, I would really love to hear from you, and here's why. I would really love to hear from you.

It really does help. I was talking to my friend Arielle and she said that, you know, while they don't help with the ra, with the algorithms, it does mean that ultimately people are seeing that there are people here listening before them. So you could say something like that and then change that up, you know, use a different anecdote next time.

Akta: Yeah, I like that because it also encourages this sense of, I guess, community as well around the podcast. Are there other ways that creators can do that, like build a community from their podcast? Yeah, 

Arielle: tons. I mean, it depends. My, I, I, so I manage the community at Squad cast and a lot of people have asked me over the years like, you know, I think it's very buzzy to say, oh, I'm building a community around my podcast.

I'm building a community around this. I'm building. Not everything needs a community. So again, like social media, I want you to take, take a, take the weight off your shoulders to think like, why isn't my social media converting? Also, you don't necessarily need a community around your podcast. Not every podcast lends itself to community.

Um, if your podcast is a five minute podcast about the news in the podcast space, for example, there is a podcast like that. It's called Pod News. It's great pod news.net. There's also a daily newsletter, pod news.net. James, who is the editor there, doesn't necessarily need to be building a community around this.

He needs to be building loyal subscribers who share his links. Mm-hmm. But that doesn't necessarily mean they're getting together every day on circle or on Slack, and they're discussing how awesome it was. And that is okay. Yeah, true. So I want you to think about, not you, I want, I want the listeners, if you have a podcast, if you have a YouTube channel, if you have a this, if you have a that to think.

What are your listeners doing while they're listening to your show? Maybe your show is perfect for shower listening, and if that's the case, maybe they don't have time to, like, maybe their hand is wet so they can't like go and like go to circle dot. So, and like, uh, share their favorite memory of childhood with you or whatever.

It could be that your show is a really great driving podcast and you'll only know this if you do some sort of audience research. Again, going back to the, asking your questions and if you can get a sense of. The average person is doing while they're listening to your podcast and you know that maybe your podcast is about mental health, then it probably can lend itself to a community.

Um, maybe your podcast is about sports and people really love the cult of personality around you as the host. Maybe then there's a community that that springs up around your show. But I think if you have to force it, It's not, it's not, it's not gonna come naturally. Like I think if you are begging, you are pulling, pulling teeth to try to get people to respond to you in some way, then it's gonna be pretty hard to build a community around your podcast.

Akta: Yeah. I love how real that is, to be honest. Um, so you've been on the podcast space for a long time, I think you've been working in the podcast space since 2017. What has changed since then and what do. Predict for podcast, like how will everything 

Arielle: change? Um, big Money has rolled in to the podcast space and then rolled out to a certain extent.

Um, we just heard late last year and early this year that a lot of the, um, a lot of the mergers and acquisitions are, they're not. Yeah, some things are, are not as positive as they were maybe two years ago. Um, and it could be because of the perceived economic downturn or the economic downturn depending on where you are.

Um, but yeah, like a lot of companies have rolled up. So SiriusXM is a pretty big player. iHeartRadio is a pretty big player. Spotify big player, npr, big player. And a lot of these companies have made smaller acquisitions within and then have let people. Um, or have cut productions, or have cut budgets. And celebrity podcasts are also a thing, and they will continue to be a thing because a lot of bigger production agencies make a bet and say, you know, they're gonna bring in listeners.

And either they do or they don't, depending on how that celebrity is able to, um, garner an audience. And so I, I see those continuing, but what I don't necessarily see continuing is just spending, spending, spending on. More acquisitions. I think that's gonna pause for the near future. And I think independent creators will continue to make audio.

That is my prediction, is they will not stop. And that's a beautiful thing. And sometimes those independent productions will take off and they will find audiences and they will even build communities. And maybe they're even gonna find funding. Um, maybe they will get picked up by larger agencies, but independent creators.

We'll do it on shoestring budgets no matter what. Whereas the people that are waiting for larger funding, the people that are looking to get picked up by I, by iHeart, by Sirius xm, by Spotify, by glim, by Gimlet, um, I don't necessarily see those continuing to happen, at least for the next six months or so.

But independent creators go forth and continue creating, they will. You know, I don't even have to everybody, like if you talk to anybody, they're still, the average person is like, oh, you know, I'm gonna start a podcast with my friends. That's still happening. True. Yeah. And whether, and we talked about this, maybe those shows will go nowhere.

Yeah. But, but they could also just be fun. Yeah. And some of those, uh, percentage of those will do well and they will find an audience. 

Akta: Have you ever seen any podcasts with any really, like, unique ideas that have stood out to you and you, you just thought, wow, that's a great idea 

Arielle: for a podcast? Oh my God, yeah.

There's a really great podcast. I was speaking to the creator of it yesterday. Her name is Lizzie Cooperman. The show is called In Your Hands with Lizzie Cooperman. This is a show that is only possible because of podcasts. Basically what she does, Every episode she presents her listeners with two choices and they're life choices that she, that they decide on for her and she does them.

Oh my God. And yeah, and it is hilarious. And it is, and she, so she, she has gotten ear piercings because of this. She has become a magician because of this. She's become a tarot reader because of this. She has, um, worked at Victoria's Secret because of this, like she has let her listeners run her life for the past year.

And this is something that is only possible because, Podcast like that is not a show that would get green lit on a tv, you know, show. Yeah. So I kind of 

Akta: love that, especially it's an everything thinker. I'm like, oh, that sounds quite good. I feel like I need to run my life 

Arielle: that way. It, it, it's amazing. And, and like ultimately, um, it's hard.

Like she. Her life is being run by her listeners, but it's also beautiful. And she also uses Instagram to, so what she does is she presents these two uh, possibilities. Then she has experts on to talk her through those possibilities. And then she says, listeners go to my Instagram story. You have 24 hours to vote, um, on what I should do.

And then in the next episode she reveals, that 

Akta: sounds so fun. I'm gonna definitely listen to that. It's great. It's so good. And what are your So good, your favorite podcast set? Like which ones do you always listen? 

Arielle: Yeah. Um, good question. I don't have a favorite podcast because they're always changing and there's so much out there.

But I do have shows that I will always come back to and that I've been a longtime listener of. So I really love, um, I listen to a daily podcast called The Daily Zeitgeist. It's news and information, um, from a comedic perspective just has a really, a great cult of personality around the hosts and a really great community.

Um, a lot of people listen to it. A lot of people say that they listen to it on social, and there's a discord for. Um, I always listen to Today Explained, which is another Daily News podcast from Vox. Um, again, just like really smart and a different take on the news. Um, I always listen to history podcast. I love history podcasts.

I listen to one called History Daily. It's 15 minutes of on this day in history every single day. Um, I. Listen to, um, scam Goddess is one of my favorite comedy shows. It's a weekly show. The host is Lacy Mosley. She's just really sharp and funny and she kind of goes through different scams that are happening in the world with a comedian and they joke about it and it's like true crime without the murder.

So I think we all need that a little bit right now. Um, I always go back to Radiolab, this American Life, the big ones, uh, 99% invisible, but then I'm. Also listening to some independent podcasts and some shows that, um, are coming out week, um, in series. And then I'm just like listening through those series.

And right now I'm listening to Alphabet Boys, which is, um, a podcast about, um, how in 2020 the F B I infiltrated racial, uh, the F B I infiltrated protests around George Floyd's death in the us. It is a fascinating story and it's just not something I would've known about if it had not been for audio. I mean, I'm sure this was written about, but again, like I said, not a huge reader.

So yeah, I mean, it's something that I had an inkling of just by. Reading about it a little bit here and there, but like, this is a deep dive into it that I, that I really enjoy. Um, I listen to, you're Dead To Me, which is a really great history show from, uh, the B bbc. Um, they have one comedian on and one historian on, and they go through people that are dead.

Similarly, I listen to a podcast called Obituaries from, um, a comedian and historian. I guess I don. He considers himself a historian named moca and he Eulogizes obituaries. Obituaries. His name is Mo. Um, he eulogizes concepts and things that are dead. So he, for example, eulogize, the Neanderthals and like when they died and like how they died out and how that affected human civilization.

It is the coolest show and it makes me laugh out loud and it's beautiful. He eulogized, um, the, the Grow. Michelle Banana. Do you know about, I know this is not what you asked for, but now we're on a ranch. No, I will. Yeah, let's go for it. He, so we, all the world basically at this point only eats, or in the US let's say, I don't know about the world, we only eat a banana called the Cav dish.

It's like the, the regular standard banana. But a hundred years ago there were more banana VA varieties and one of them was called the Grammy shell, and it basically died out because of a, a. And, uh, an infection and like it was way tastier and this is just not something that I would've known about. No, 

Akta: isn't.

I love finding. Yeah. I love finding interesting facts like that. That's so cool. Yeah. 

Arielle: And then I'll just, I'll share one more. Yeah, go for it. Okay. There's a great show called Crime Writers On, uh, I recommend this show if you podcast in any way, because it's really about serialized investigative podcasts and they talk.

Uh, one podcast, tw I think they talk about two podcasts every week, usually serialized podcasts. And, um, they, they talk about what they liked about the show, what they didn't like about the show, the journalistic integrity. And it is just a masterclass in how to make a podcast and what you should look out for.

And I recommend it as a podcast listener. As a podcast creator. I just think the whole panel is really, 

Akta: Amazing. I, I love the, like the range of recommendations there, so I'm definitely gonna check out some of them. I'm gonna finish with a quick fire round, so I'm gonna ask you five questions I ask every creator that comes on air.

So the first one, what's your favorite thing about being a creator? 

Arielle: Flexibility. So flexibility in the sense that I am flexible. I've learned to become flexible, but also in that I think you need to be flexible in order to. Constantly be rolling with the changes that that, that come about in this industry.

Um, and that other people are flexible too, I think. I think generally speaking, creators tend to understand that in order to grow, in order to roll with the punches, we all sort of need to be flexible. And I think I love that, um, that we're all sort of in this give and take. 

Akta: I Jo, I love that answer because most of the creators who come on air give the answer a flexibility, but from the mindset of, you know, I get flexible working hours and things like that, I love how you turn flexibility into something else.

Um, what's your favorite tool to help you create. 

Arielle: Canva. Nice. Yeah. Do a lot of people say that? 

Akta: Um, I think notion's the most common, but Canva comes in 

Arielle: a close second. Yeah. I wish I understood notion better. I really need to get organized like I'm, I am. I've never claimed to be an organized person, so if you're listening to this and you think you can help me, please, please reach out.

I'm begging, but I love Canva. Use it like 15 times a day. 

Akta: Yeah. I love camera too. And what's something that gives you the most inspiration for when you create podcasts? 

Arielle: Oh, nice and simple. Truly. I mean, yeah, I, I think, um, everything that I do, if I'm ever in a creative rut, I go on a podcast walk, I just like, oh, I love that.

Have no destination in mind. And I like go walk and I listen to a podcast and by the time I come back, I've, I've had an idea. 

Akta: Yeah. And what's something that helps with your creator? Wet life? Balance. 

Arielle: Balance. Um, that's such a good question. Balance. Um, um, I play. Oh, cool. I love 

Akta: that. Yeah. And what's one piece of advice that you'd give to other creators?

Arielle: Try not to see people who have similar topics or um, who are sort of in your niche as competition, but as potential collaborators. 

Akta: Oh, that's really good advice. I like that. Thank you so much for coming on air. This has been such a fun conversation about podcasts and I so appreciate you sharing all your insights because it's something I'm definitely gonna take on board for this podcast.

Arielle: Thank you for having me. It was really fun. 

Akta: If you are a podcast host, I'd love to know what your strategy is. And if you'd like to know more about Arielle you can find her on Instagram, TikTok and Twitter, or check out her website. And if you're a creator, check out Passion Fruit. We help you to do sponsors without the hassle.

Thanks for listening in, and we'll see you in the next one.